Typically, smaller tiles provide ridges between the tiles, giving you more grip on the floor to prevent slips. Hold one end of a bubble level on the drain opening and slide the other end of the level across the existing tile's surface to check the floor's slope. If we do use the large format tiles, what is the largest the tiles on the shower floor can be? Any larger than that, and the tiles wont be able to conform to the gentle slope of the mud pan. Large tiles in a shower are really not a good idea. As a tile shower floor ages, its imperfections quickly turn into an eyesore. I'll keep you all posted on how it works out and if we can figure a solution. @pipdog the shower floor looks amazing. Can you use large tiles on a shower floor? Only if there is a 3" deep whole or a 3" tall stone pocking out will they do anything more if carpet is called for. The pattern of the layout is called Envelope Cuts or X-Pattern Cuts, which are designed to properly slope water directly to the shower drain. For a standard "bowl"-shaped slope, again, it depends on the size and shape of the bowlbut usually four inch squares is a safe starting point. However, you need to ensure your shower pan meets the criteria listed earlier. Lightly press the shower floor tile into the wet thinset with a clean grout float. I'm not going to fuel the greed of contractors and Co. Instead of installing the traditional and old fashioned 2 x 2 mosaic tile on your shower base, you should consider a large format tile (24 x 24 or larger). This method is usually much more expensive than the traditional or thin-bed approaches, but it does provide more predictable results. They provided a bit more traction underfoot. Those numbers should be on the box the tile came in. If your next bathroom remodel includes a tub or prefab fiberglass shower base, then the installation is going to be pretty straightforward. After the new tile floor dries, the ring will hold the drain cover flush with the new shower floor tile's finished surface. Minimalist Grouting When you use bigger tiles, you use less. So I didn't press forward with it because even though I like the look of linear drains, I wasn't willing to pay a fortune for one. Do you have any information on this, like how to seal the drain to pan? At Coco Tile, we have developed a unique way to install a large format tile into any size of custom shower base. The mortar is the most under-thought element in installing a new shower floor. Note that there are companies that sell forms that help get the slope right. Vacuum any debris from the grout joints. Does anyone have any photos of large format tiles installed in a shower floor with a center drain? If your existing shower floor flexes, the new tile will crack in the same areas. Question: I have been told by several tilers that you cannot put tile over tile because it will crack. I think it will be ok as a large format shower floor. The membrane also extends several inches up the walls of the shower framing, creating a waterproof pan. One other thing I've done a couple of times with large format that we figured would be too slippery in full tile size was scoring light lines across the surface of the tile. Mix a white-colored thinset in a bucket, using the thinset manufacturer's instructions. Wait 24 hours before continuing. My tile setter recommended nothing larger than 4" x 4" on the floor of my shower. We have a Duravit tub that does not have a slip-resistant surface, and we've showered in it for years with no problems. Bert spent 25 years working as a home-improvement and residential construction contractor in central Florida. Hoping to do the same with my shower. Tile nippers chip clean up tight corners that the grinder cant reach. It is possible the tile salesman wants you to rip up the old floor and subfloor so that he can sell you more than just the thinset and pebble-tile you need to give the shower a facelift. As a result, you get a shower floor that floods easily. Always follow the manufacturer's powder grout to water ratio. Here are some of the examples I've seen that have similar tile configuration (our shower will have a curb that will be made out of quartz and a center drain). Thanks, all. A single raised tile can hold enough water to create a puddle. Therefore, if your shower pan has the size to accommodate large tiles and still manages to drain properly, you wont have any issues. Question: Would it be possible to tile over existing shower wall and ceiling tile? Pressing the Escape (ESC) button will close the modal and bring you back to where you were on the page. These cracks are evidence of a subfloor problem that needs to be addressed first. Using low-quality products results in water getting under the tiles, causing mould growth and discoloration. So long as it stands up to every day life (with the anti fracture membrane you have a very good chance it will work hard for a very long time) you have a functional floor - albeit not the one you envisioned. Make the cuts with an electric tile cutter or a set of tile nippers. The crack reduction membrane is standard and should have been included in the first quote. Also, most mosaic tiles installed on shower bases are usually spaced apart at 1/8 while we install large format tile with 1/16 spacing between each tile, meaning the grout lines are half the thickness on the shower base. I saw a site built fiberglass shower pan in Austin , Texas recently and was pretty surprised it met code. I'm meeting with my tile installer tomorrow so I am going to walk through options with him. Carpet hides a plethora of problems. @Jessica Uhler Hi there, We ended up with not doing the remodel of our small bathroom at all. Modern showers can feature larger designs with more floor space. The square cover makes cutting the tile around the opening easier. If the existing shower floor does not have the proper slope, build up the low area with thinset. Let's assume you can get the slope right in a pre-formed center drain shower. A pro tilesetter gives tips for a solid installation without removing existing tiles. many thanks. Measure the space between the full sheets of tile and the adjacent wall. I dont know where youre getting it, but I dont think anyone has suggested that particular tiles have their slipperiness change based on the type of drain thats not true. When measured from the drain opening to the furthest wall, the level should show about 1/4-inch of slope per foot. In larger showers you may be able to go larger than 4". Question: Is it possible to take the tile off of the shower curb and the walls to re-tile, but leave the existing shower floor tile in place and follow the steps outlined here? 2022 The Arena Media Brands, LLC and respective content providers on this website. Continue to stir the grout until all of the dry powder has mixed and the wet grout has a uniform color. Waterproofing a window in a tiled shower There are a few different ways to approach this project. What you have does not look good. I'd offer that a fourth option, that I'd place at #1, would be the Schluter Kerdi shower system. Remove all of the old caulking material from the perimeter of the shower floor, including the caulking covering the bottom six inches of each of the wall's corners. Just out of curiosity what was his reason for not wanting to do linear drains? If they are all very flat and are all very close to identical in size = rectified. We have 2-inch white tiles because we could not find a mosaic match the stone and wood look of our walls. And, as I explained above, a linear drain can be used with a central drain (unless the tile bed has already been installed). It does have a texture, so it might work just fine in the shower. It could be labeled as COFW and COFD or letters to that effect. That is my two cents. An even simpler option is to eliminate the mud altogether, and choose a sloped shower pan that already has the waterproofing layer attached. Start your subscription today and save up to 70%. Clean any leftover grout on the tile that the rag will not remove with white vinegar and a stiff-bristled nylon brush. Since most showers are small spaces, using large tiles on the floor interferes with the shower pan slope. Smaller tiles are easier to adjust to a gradient, allowing the water to run away freely down the drain. Techniques weve learnt from European Master Tile Setters in Italy are now implemented on our very own jobs, right here in Ottawa. A center-drain inverted (and truncated) pyramid slope with four distinct sloping planes can take large format as four triangular pieces. Sign up for eletters today and get the latest how-to from Fine Homebuilding, plus special offers. I'm seeing quite a few decent looking installations of larger format tile with center drains, so I'm hopeful that this look is not limited to linear drains. What is your professional opinion? In smaller showers you may have to go smaller. Preferably, you want a tile offering a COF of 0.6 for your new shower floor. Check the floor for high and low spots with the bubble level. If it's not slippery in one, why would it be slippery in another? "Another idea I had was to install small cut pieces of the large format,and then place a teak grate over them to reduce any slipping risk.". Most shower floor repairs do not need this amount of work. I know what you want to do is being done successfully. Now for the material chosen/purchased. Good luck! Answer: I wouldn't want all the extra weight on the ceiling. If I were you, I would pose this question in a thread over at the "Tile Forum". Do not install the tile surrounding the drain opening or any cut pieces of tile near the shower walls yet. The grate can also slow evaporative drying. Having money given back to you at the end of the day is not something to sneeze at. When carpet is specified as part of the "interior finish" the flooring guys do NOTHING to improve the initial pour.NOTHING. There are plenty of designs of large tiles, especially for shower floors. Bath tile: large format porcelain vs. engineered quartz slabs? Put on all safety equipment, including safety glasses and leather work gloves. It "looks" nice. Large tiles only work well with a linear drain. Get home building tips, offers, and expert advice in your inbox. Any size tile w any drain , hire wisely smart people. The bad cuts can turn an otherwise good-looking tile floor into an amateurish-looking maintenance nightmare. The COF describes the grip on the tiles surface, and whether its suitable for use on floors that get wet. Once the floor has dried, any excess white thinset will stand out against the grout; white grout makes white thinset look grey. I have never done a new build, but I have had four full bathrooms and two powder rooms remodeled. If you fit a shower floor, avoid any tiles with COFs under 0.5. Don't worry about it. Your email address will not be published. I put matte finish tile on shower by my pool and it feels ok non slip until my grandson uses half bottle of body wash. The installer told the home owner he had never had one leak. The size issue only relates to whether shower floor slope/geometry will allow a larger tile. There are plenty of large-tile designs, and you feel its the right choice for your new shower remodel. This is a dialog window which overlays the main content of the page. Laying a new layer of tile over the existing shower floor can solve these issues without removing the old tile and grout. It hides "roller coasters". Because it takes them longer to get a good result with non-rectified, they will charge more so that they don't get a complain about how it looks. Many shower floors have cut tile with sharp or rough-looking edges. The people who are good at this are artistic enough to know what does and doesn't look good and have an obsessive level of attention to detail. Two tile setters have told me that it can be installed on top of the existing floor, but people at the tile store said it is was not a good idea. Yes, I understand the topography, which is why I went with 2 x 2 hex. Thankfully the "tile guy" told them before the job started and they obviously added that cost/material to the job before anything else started. Tamp high spots down with the grout float. Shower floor sheet tile has several rows of small tile that are held together with a mesh backing. Hi sirenaeg, I'm happy with the large format tile in the shower, no issues with slipping at all after a year and a half of use. Thanks. Question: My shower tile floor doesn't have any cracks. An adapter can convert a round drain cover into a square cover. A redesign gave the room a luxe hotel feel, Quell your fears of cooking splashes, cleaning nightmares and dust with these tips from the pros, The sky's the limit for beautiful blues in your home's dining spaces; here's how to make it work, Large-Format Rectangular Tiles GIve a Bathroom a Fresh New Look, Dare you consider trading that 'coveted' design feature for something you'll actually use? They think its because each batch may be different. As upsetting as the result is to you, it might be worth taking the 55% refund and do what you want with it. Cut in the corners with the edge of a margin trowel. That should have included sanding (which they did) plus leveling (which they didthat's the 1/8" you paid for). Fill any dips or missing tile in the existing tile floor with the thinset, using a flat trowel to feather the thinset into the surrounding tile. Often while tamping the floor, excess thinset will fill the grout joints. If they wobble (because they are warped) on the table = non rectified. Because if the membrane under the thick layer of mud is installed without an adequate slope or the weeping mechanism in the adjustable drain is blocked, water will just sit in the mortar bed and never dry, and that can lead to problems with grout failure or worse. If you redo the shower floor, remove everything down to the subfloor. As to how small you need them to be based on the showeritself, it depends on the shape and slope of the mud. Keep the tile full size and install a linear drain. The higher the COF the less slippery the tile will be. Attractive Aesthetics Large tiles on the shower floor enhance your bathrooms aesthetic, lifting your property demand and value. Thats the concept for a thin-bed mud pan installation. Spread the thinset on the shower floor with a notched trowel, starting at the far corner and working toward the shower curb. How about a single sloped shower into a linear drain? Germain, the plumbing has already been installed and we have a center drain, so we can't change to a linear drain at this point, although I should have pushed harder for a linear drain -- my contractor didn't want to do one. But, if youre thinking of installing a tile shower floor, youve got some decisions to make when it comes to your method of installation. Billbeee at en.wikipedia [GFDL (http://www.gnu.org/copyleft/fdl.html), CC-BY-SA-3.0 (http://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-sa/3.0/) or CC-BY-2.5 (htt. If the drain is in the center, the tile you choose cant be more than 4 in. The second reason why people typically use smaller tiles on shower floors is to provide more traction to the surface. Slide the level across the floor and mark all high and low areas with a wax pencil or permanent marker. 2022 The Taunton Press, Inc. All rights reserved. Its important to note the Coefficient of Friction (COF) of your shower tiles to prevent slips-and-falls. There are ways though that you can check what you are really getting. This option might be a good choice for anybody whos nervous about their skills with dry-packed mortar. Read on to learn how to tile over an existing shower floor! However, other issues need to be kept in mind, such as, the extra tile thickness means the shower valve often requires longer escutcheon screws, glass enclosure's size needs to be adjusted, and so on. The material cost buy-in is higher than a couple yards of PVC membrane and the bags of mortar, but it results in a thoroughly impermeable barrier between the wet and dry sides, and and smooth, flat, square base upon which to set your tile. Here are several videos and articles that show all the steps you need to execute a high-quality tile installation: Video Series: Tile a Barrier-Free Bathroom See the entire installation process, from mortar base to tile to linear drain. Check the coefficient of friction both wet and dry. Tile Redi is one company that makes these shower pans in both standard and custom sizes. Wash the floor with a damp sponge. We can't do a linear drain because the plumbing is installed and it is plumbed for a central drain. Schluter instructions say no smaller than 2" on Kerdi so I plan to use 6"x24" in 4'x10' shower with very gradual slope in two planes plane toward 4' linear drain. It really does depend on the tile and its wet coefficient of friction. Add more thinset to any low tile. Use an angle grinder to cut the tile touching the shower drain opening. The grates can feel pretty nice underfoot. Failing that, you don't want to go larger than 4"preferably 2"Yes, you could cut down the larger tiles, but would probably need to "dress" the edges to make them more comfortable. The most popular large-size tile measures 12 x 24, giving you plenty of floor coverage. Lightly tamp the tile into the wet thinset with a grout float. When working on a larger shower floor, consider laying about half of the tile at a time, completing the far half first. The wall tile is often possible. Sorry I cannot be of more help. He told me installation would be "significantly higher" than a normal center drain, which usually means he doesn't want to do it or isn't sure how to do it. Anyway, the porcelain thin slabs themselves are just so expensive to install on the walls and floor (around $50-60 per square foot) that we put that idea to rest. White-colored thinset will not bleed through the new shower tile's grout. It dries completely, immediately after use, and has never grown so much as a speck of mold or mildew. Concrete slabs are created by the initial pour (first weeks of construction). But we can't find smaller mosaic tile that is a good match to the 48x48 tile on the floors, and I'd rather have the continuity of flooring throughout the bathroom and not be broken up with different tile on the shower floor. Always remember to use top-quality grout, adhesive, and membranes when fitting your shower floor. Thanks! The small pieces let the tile follow the slope of the floor. Wait about one hour before continuing. The backing keeps the grout joints between each small piece even. But we are still going to use large format tile in a diamond cut pattern, and will likely put a teak grate over top to reduce any concerns of slipping. Lay each full sheet of uncut tile on the shower floor. Traditionally, shower floors feature smaller tiles, but why? Earlier I mentioned the option of a form that helps you create a perfect slope. But you do need a tile installer with experience doing these minimal modern showers. Soyou have a slab that was probably in the $2.50 - $4/sf range for subfloor prep. 2022 Coco Tile Flooring Contractor Inc. If you are working in a larger shower, start at a far corner and work back toward the door. However, modern ceramic tiles come with textured surfaces for grip in the shower. Hold the grout float at a 45-degree angle to the tile floor. Larger tiles look good on shower floors if they match the bathroom dcor. My instinct tells me if it is a small space that using the same tile on both the floor and in the shower would give a more cohesive look. Besides the beautiful look of these European shower bases, one other very important defining factor that makes them extremely better than the traditional North American shower base is that they have about95% less grout lines. After the grout has dried, polish the tile's surface with a clean dry rag. Can I tile over a tiled shower pan? Sometimes the seller knowingly or unknowingly will try to sell you marble as quartzite. What Is the Coefficient of Friction on a Large Shower Tile? If we slip on the 50% more slip resistant tile I like the idea of scoring light lines across the surface of the tile but it sounds like alot of work. I have heard some mixed advice, and have seen very few related articles on the subject. The first I installed close to ten years ago has performed as advertised. HubPages is a registered trademark of The Arena Platform, Inc. Other product and company names shown may be trademarks of their respective owners. They turned out well. This is the traditionalist approach to preparing a shower floor, and requires some labor. Are you sure you can do this successfully? How slippery tiles are varies greatly. You need a good-quality mortar to ensure a safe and secure surface. in a linear drain shower but not ok in a center drain shower. Yes, its entirely possible to use larger size tiles on your bathroom floor. Good. We recommend you determine the right tiles for your shower floor by matching them to your bathrooms theme. We have an excellent start to finish article, Installing a Leakproof Shower Pan, on the process, but heres whats involved: After the shower has been rough framed, a thin layer of Portland cement and sand (aka mud), just wet enough to cling together, is laid across the subfloor and pitched toward an adjustable drain in the center, or to a linear drain along one of the edges. However, I hate the style and color, and I want to install a pebble floor. If the gradient is only in one plane then larger tiles should work just fine. If youre having trouble choosing the best tile options for your shower floor, call an expert. The grout must completely fill the cavity between each set of tiles. Mix sanded tile grout, using the grout manufacturer's directions, in a bucket with water. The last thing you need is to slip on your tiles whilst taking a shower. Run a straightedge across the floor's surface and shave off any high areas of thinset. If you cant find the COF value, call the manufacturer for the information. That means the floor stays in one or two flat planes and any size tile can be used. An improperly created subsurface causes high and low spots in the finished floor. Adjust each full sheet of tile until the grout joints between the sheets match the joints between the individual pieces of tile. I'm wondering, though, is it any more slippery than having a tub? Both of these issues promote mold and mildew growth in the grout and subfloor, which darkens the grout in the problem area. Thoroughly clean the entire shower stall, using any household cleaner that removes soap scum and hard-water deposits. Our master bath has extra large format floors (48x48), and we have a bunch of leftover tile, and I am trying to figure out if we can use the same tiles in the shower, just cut down in size a bit. This thinset will bleed through the grout covering it. Clean the floor with a damp sponge, using circular wiping motions. Stuff a rag into the top of the drain hole. OKso they actually did a little bit of work and they did the crack reduction membrane (albeit as a cost you were not expecting). By Famrnylongras CC-BY-SA-3.0 | Wikimedia Commons. According to professional tilers, small tiles help you achieve two primary objectives when fitting a shower floor. This thin-bed mud approach is also the method of choice when building a barrier-free bath, where the floor of the bathroom connects directly with the floor of the shower rather than being separated by a curb (see A Sloping Floor for a Barrier-Free Bath, and also our full video series on the same topic: Tile a Barrier-Free Bathroom). Most shower floors require about one gallon of thinset. Double-check the floor for slope and dips with the level. I called the tile place and they looked up the specs from the Spanish manufacturer, and it's not available. By Hardyplants (Own work) [CC-BY-SA-3.0 (http://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-sa/3.0)], via Wikimedia Commons. I kid you not. I've done that in showers and once on a tiled exterior balcony. The Arena Media Brands, LLC and respective content providers to this website may receive compensation for some links to products and services on this website. Tiling Project Guide. The tiles are 12"X12" and they are not slippery ar all. Here's how it turned out in our guest bath: I'd say no, due to needing a slope, and that they will be really slippery once wet/soap on them. Or remember to rinse Aaron's soap off the floor before you walk in? Do not worry about damaging the neighboring floor tile. From there, sheets of tile backerboard are fastened to the wall framing, and another 2 to 3 inch layer of Portland cement and sand are applied over the membrane, again sloped towards the drain. So it meets the minimum, but have no idea what the actual DCOF is. Answer: The new tile will not crack when properly attached to a non-flexing solid subfloor. Getting the slope of the mortar bed right isnt unreasonably difficult, but there are ways to get it wrong, especially if this is your first try working with dry-packed mortar. Each settlement crack in the grout creates a pathway for water to seep into the concrete subfloor. Any problems with puddling or installation? Hiring a GC in the Seattle area to remodel a 7x8.5 bathroom costs another $20K minimum (we live in a condo), so for now it's Hawaii. Doing that is of out-of-the-box, so it depends on the tile, and of course, the owner. And although its often shown being used for small shower stalls, its perfectly suitable for larger installations, such as replacing a tub with a shower, too. Answer: The new tile will crack again if the foundation continues to settle. Now I am not sure what to do. I've found a couple inspiration photos on Houzz where larger format tiles are used in a shower, but my tile installer is reluctant to do this and is pushing me to get mosaic tiles for the shower floor. MongoCT, very helpful advice. Germain, I suspect the reason my contractor didn't want to do it was because he hadn't done many before. Thanks for the link @Creative Tile Eastern CT. Once the top layer of cement has dried, tile can be adhered to your new pan using thinset cement. There is a super easy way to find out if you have rectified or non-rectified: Pull out 10 pieces and lay them flat on a table or flat surface. Today, large tiles are available in a variety of styles and designs. Tile is then adhered to the top of the membrane using thinset cement. Dump the grout on the tile floor and press the grout into the joints with a rubber grout float. So far they were on the up and up. I've done a few of those as well, I have one in my own house up in Maine. Video Series: Tile a Barrier-Free Bathroom, Expert insights on techniques and principles. Look for large grout or tile cracks that run across the entire floor. Carpet removed.ooooh dear. With fewer grout lines, this versatile material brings a smooth appearance to walls and floors, Feeling Good Underfoot: Shower Tiles, Mosaics, Teak Slats and Pebbles, Bad remodels had managed to leave this couple cramped in an expansive bath. Sometimes even 4X4 is stretching it with a conventional center drain where the slope is pitched and coming from all directions. I am also going to get a large piece of the tile wet and throw some soap on it to see how slippery it really is. Become a member and get unlimited site access, including the Just wish I could find the actual DCOF, or at least something more firm than "maybe greater than .42". Therefore, you dont have to worry about slip-and-falls in the shower that result in injury. So, lets start with understanding why showers typically use smaller tiles over larger ones. Become a member and get instant access to thousands of videos, how-tos, tool reviews, and design features. Continue to add thinset to the problem areas, as needed. I suppose tile with deep rough texture would be better on wet soap? I have two showers: one where the tiles were super-glossy porcelain (which was fine in large format for the walls), but what went on the floor was 2X2's to increase the number of grout lines for traction; another (picture above), where the tiles have a sheen, but are incredibly non-slippery, and I went with 12X12's. Grout affords you a non slip surface, particularly on the more slippery tiles. In this post, well unpack the mystery behind using large tiles on your shower floor. Make a bucket of white-colored thinset, using the manufacturer's wet-mix ratio, if applicable. I would not trust the drywall above to hold two layers of tile, grout, and thinset. Upgrading to a Tile Shower Learn from a pro tilesetter how to remove an old bathtub and replace it with a custom tile shower. Your email address will not be published. Inspect each grout joint for thinset. Is the person who did it related to the GC? https://www.tcnatile.com/images/pdfs/DCOFBrochure_Aug2013_Comp.pdf, So I've run into a scenario where the tile I want for my shower floor has a DCOF of greater than or equal to .42. After adhering the pre-sloped base to the subfloor, and then the pre-bonded pan waterproofing membrane is integrated with the waterproofing of the walls, and the surface is ready to be tiled.